Fenders/Mudguards on a Touring Bike?

[Tim Smith]

I've been doing some re-thinking about using these on a touring bike.

It started when I was about to install that classy leather front mud
flap that you can get as an accessory for Berthoud stainless steel
fenders. Then I thought "Hey, wait a minute! This is a touring bike,
not a commuting bike. A flap will keep your feet drier on a short
ride in the rain, but if you ride in the rain for an hour or more,
you're going to get wet anyhow". So I decided to hold off installing
it for now.

Then some more pondering: if you're riding with a handlebar bag, and
you have the top of your rear rack covered (sleeping bag, tent,
whatever), are fenders really going to keep you that much drier on a
long ride in the rain? So it would seem that the main advantage of
them would be to keep (some of) the road grit off the bike and your
luggage.

I've always toured with fenders (usually Esges (SKS) or Bleumels),
except for one 4-day California trip when I saw no rain at all.
Perhaps just a short section of fender under the front brake, to keep
some of the grit away from the headset, would be all that is needed?

Any comments, ideas, or experiences?

Tim Smith

[Jerry]

Subject: Fenders/Mudguards on a Touring Bike?
I've been doing some re-thinking about using these on a touring bike.

Tim, I agree with you since your thinking fits my style of touring. My wife
and I credit card tour. Although we ride in the rain when necessary, we try
to avoid it by:
1. Picking places to tour where it's not the rainy season.
2. Opting to "wait out" the worst of the downpours when they do occur.

When riding our singles, I ride with only a snap on front fender (about a
quarter wheel coverage) and a quarter rear fender (from trunk forward to
front derailleur on the seat tube). My wife rides with a full set of
fenders. On the few occasions when we really rode for long periods in heavy
rain, she was just as wet and dirty as I was with my minimal setup.

In the past, on the tandem we had only a quarter fender on the rear wheel
from the trunk forward to the stoker's cranks. The front was fender less. I
really didn't notice that much spray when riding in the rain. The handlebar
bag and down tube blocked most of it. I've added a front fender for our tour
of France in 2006 but this is sort of a test. If I find it too much of a
pain and not useful, I'll pull it on future tours.

We live in the Central Valley of California where fenders are almost as
unheard of as rain! For just pleasure riding the fenders stay home.

It all boils down to KISS (Keep It SIMPLE Stupid!). A set of fenders is one
more thing to go wrong.

Jerry and Jeanette's Burley Baby
2002 Burley Duet S&S Tandem
TH 4.86(430*113)
www.touringonbikes.us

[Chuck Harmon]

Post by Jerry
It all boils down to KISS (Keep It SIMPLE Stupid!).
A set of fenders is one more thing to go wrong.

It depends where you are touring. I do use fenders
and last year when I toured on Mackinac Island I was
sure glad I had them. They do not allow cars on
Mackinac Island and the roads were full of Amish
Exhaust (if you get my drift). I was the only one in
our touring group that was not full of sh** after our
day on the island.

I also believe that a set of full fenders help keep
your drive train clean in wet weather. I have had far
fewer problems with my drive train on self contained
tours where I have used fenders. I now have them on
all of my bikes and I just leave them on year round.
They almost never cause me any problems and once
installed I seldom need to adjust them.

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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[. dkoloko]

Post by Chuck Harmon
I also believe that a set of full fenders help keep
your drive train clean in wet weather.

Fenders also protect the headset and brakes from grit in the water
splashed up as you ride. Protection for brakes may be more important
in snow, but headset benefits from fender protection, rain or snow.

As far perception of protection of bicycle, in general, and of self
from fenders, I look at underside of fenders and flaps and see much
grit that was saved from getting on bike or me. As far as purported
protection from handlebar bag, I'd rather grit piled underneath
fenders, than underneath bag.

Demetri

[Moni]

Tim, I have fenders on my touring bike, but on my go fast club ride
bike I don't. If it looks like rain, I will ride the fender bike even
on club and T-shrit rides. I truly believe they make a HUGE
difference, specially if you have decent mud guards.

Moni

You can see my fender bike here:
http://dreamtour.crazyguyonabike.com
then click on: Introduction

Post by Tim Smith
I've been doing some re-thinking about using these on a touring bike.
It started when I was about to install that classy leather front mud
flap that you can get as an accessory for Berthoud stainless steel
fenders. Then I thought "Hey, wait a minute! This is a touring bike,
not a commuting bike. A flap will keep your feet drier on a short
ride in the rain, but if you ride in the rain for an hour or more,
you're going to get wet anyhow". So I decided to hold off installing
it for now.
Then some more pondering: if you're riding with a handlebar bag, and
you have the top of your rear rack covered (sleeping bag, tent,
whatever), are fenders really going to keep you that much drier on a
long ride in the rain? So it would seem that the main advantage of
them would be to keep (some of) the road grit off the bike and your
luggage.
I've always toured with fenders (usually Esges (SKS) or Bleumels),
except for one 4-day California trip when I saw no rain at all.
Perhaps just a short section of fender under the front brake, to keep
some of the grit away from the headset, would be all that is needed?
Any comments, ideas, or experiences?
Tim Smith

[Harv Welch]

Post by Tim Smith
I've been doing some re-thinking about using these on a touring bike.
It started when I was about to install that classy leather front mud
flap that you can get as an accessory for Berthoud stainless steel
fenders. Then I thought "Hey, wait a minute! This is a touring bike,
not a commuting bike. A flap will keep your feet drier on a short
ride in the rain, but if you ride in the rain for an hour or more,
you're going to get wet anyhow". So I decided to hold off installing
it for now.

Tim... First off, from my 'experience', the first time you are rounding a
corner, and there is an unavoidable pile of dog scat on the roadway directly in
your path, believe me, you'll be a firm believer in the use of fenders no
matter what you're riding! ;-) Also, the use of flexible flaps dangling from
the ends of your fenders not only helps against water flipping up on your own
feet, but is also a sign of etiquate for the poor souls that are following
behind you. ;-)
________________________________________
harv welch
victoria bc canuckistan

[Jerry]

Also, the use of flexible flaps

Post by Harv Welch
dangling from
the ends of your fenders not only helps against water flipping up on your own
feet, but is also a sign of etiquette for the poor souls that are

following

Post by Harv Welch
behind you. ;-)

Harv, you must tour in different places than I do. I NEVER have had the
luxury of touring in enough company that I have to worry about another
tourer riding behind me! If only it wasn't so!!!!

Jerry and Jeanette's Burley Baby
2002 Burley Duet S&S Tandem
TH 4.86(430*113)
www.touringonbikes.us

[alex wetmore]

Then some more pondering: if you're riding with a handlebar bag, and you have
the top of your rear rack covered (sleeping bag, tent, whatever), are fenders
really going to keep you that much drier on a long ride in the rain? So it
would seem that the main advantage of them would be to keep (some of) the
road grit off the bike and your luggage.

I think this is a big advantage.

I removed the fenders from my Bridgestone RB-T about a week ago in
preperation for the upcoming cyclocross season. I've ridden maybe 30
miles on this bike since then, in a mix of dirt and pavement, and the
bike is filthy. It hasn't rained once, this is just dust that gets
thrown up by the tires.

My feet and legs and clothing stay much cleaner with fenders than
without. It is a lot nicer to remove wet but clean clothing at the
end of the day than wet tights that are covered with road dirt.

Basic fenders weigh little and add little complexity, so I see no
reason to keep them on all of the time.

alex

[alex wetmore]

Post by alex wetmore
Basic fenders weigh little and add little complexity, so I see no
reason to keep them on all of the time.

Demetri pointed out that I probably meant "I see no reason not to keep
them on all of the time" and he is correct.

alex

[michael d smith]

I just returned from a 2500mi. tour on my befendered bike and I was glad
I had them, mainly to keep my stuff clean. I have to echo Chuck's
observation about horse pollution (I went to Mackinac, too - nice
riding!) but I must point out that the same goes for roadkill. I'll
spare you all the (literally) gory details, but sometimes you just can't
avoid 'em. My companion did not have fenders and I can tell you that's
not the kind of thing you want to discover on your gear at the end of a
long day...

The only downside I encountered was on dry dirt roads. We discovered
that in northern and UP Michigan lots of nice country roads suddenly
become unpaved. The Gazetteer doesn't always tell you where this
happens, so we road a lot of them. I was using Ortlieb panniers on a
low rider rack and would find fine grit on top of them (in the rolls) at
the end of the day. My friend didn't have this problem. We figured it
was dust that got picked up by the tire and ricocheted of the inside of
the fender and fell into my bags.

Annoying, yes, but I'll take sand over squirrel intestines any day...

Cheers- Mike in So. Boston

[Wayne Estes]

There are numerous situations in dry weather where fenders keep your
body, bike, and panniers cleaner. Animal waste on the road (from
horses, mainly) is one example. Another example is patches of sand and
dirt that can get thrown into the chain or into the headset. The best
dry-weather use for fenders that I've found is on roads that are under
construction or freshly chip-sealed. I've ridden on several roads that
had a fresh layer of sludgy oil that slings off the tires. Even worse
is a fresh layer of rocky asphalt or chipseal, which causes tarry rocks
to sling off the tires and adhere to almost everything they touch. It's
not often that I ride in conditions like that, but it has happened to me
several times on tours. When riding in a group, the people without
fenders had MUCH more tar on their legs, bikes, and panniers.

I returned from my Southwest Oregon tour last Friday. I was on the road
for 16 days, going from my house to the coast, and up to Diamond Lake
and Crater Lake. I swam in several rivers, soaked in a hot spring, and
ate lots of blackberries on the roadside. Hopefully I'll upload a
report to crazyguyonabike soon.

Wayne Estes
Oakland, Oregon, USA

[Ronald Herring]

Has anyone made their own fenders? I would interested in some examples (preferably w/photo link).

RonH










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[alex wetmore]

Has anyone made their own fenders? I would interested in some
examples (preferably w/photo link).

Kent Peterson makes them out of coroplast.

http://www.mile43.com/peterson/FendForYourself.html

Making ones that looked like SKS fenders might be difficult. I
don't know of other sources for plastic or metal which have
already been curved like that.

alex

[John Meier]

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ronald Herring" <rd5590-***@public.gmane.org>
To: <Touring-***@public.gmane.org>
Sent: Tuesday, August 23, 2005 10:48 AM
Subject: Making fenders

Post by Ronald Herring
Has anyone made their own fenders? I would interested in some examples
(preferably w/photo link).
RonH

Hey Kent.....here's one for you. Show him how it's done.


John Meier
Washougal, Wa

[Ronald Herring]

I was thinking of using a fiberglass methodology and using an old tire (maybe a 2 inch width) as a mold. Im not all that happy with the selection commercially available,

RonH






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[M-gineering]

Post by Ronald Herring
I was thinking of using a fiberglass methodology and using an old tire (maybe a 2 inch width) as a mold. Im not all that happy with the selection commercially available,

Should be a fum project, vacuum molding over a MTB type tyre ;). But
maybe inflating an innertube inside a casing makes more sense.

DIY Mudguards have been made from
rolled alumnium extrusions (flat shape)
flat plywood (forced in circular shape)
Glued and shaped plywood (4" springback if you only use two layers)

the stays are always the nastiest bit of the project, the usual
solutions are invariably crude

[j***@public.gmane.org]

Post by Ronald Herring
I was thinking of using a fiberglass methodology and using an old tire (maybe

a 2 inch width) as a mold. Im not all that happy with the selection commercially
available,


Ron,

Even if I value my time at $.25 USD/hr. I think that Planet Bike, Zefal, SKS, etc, etc are a steal.
I got a VERY nice CF front fender with my GRR but in the real world it is useless on anything but the cleanest roads. The underside is perfectly engineered to lock on to every bit of mud that comes it's way. The cheaper, smoother offerings tend to shed the mud more easily.
The nice thing about the political sign thing is that sometimes you can get the big ones and you don't have to splice to make up the length. When they get packed with mud you don't feel badly about tearing them off. There is an ongoing debate locally about which are the slickest, Democrat or Republician.





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[drewandmary]

For those interested in making wood fenders; I made a set about a month ago,
and put up a page about it here:
http://www.sonic.net/~maryking/wooden_fenders.html
Drew

[Ronald Herring]

Great looking fenders! Thanks for the link. I like the idea of wood (the original carbon product),

RonH










From:
"drewandmary" <maryking-65eDfwRo+***@public.gmane.org>

To:
"'Touring'" <touring-***@public.gmane.org>

Subject:
RE: Making fenders

Date:
Tue, 23 Aug 2005 16:47:49 -0700

Post by drewandmary
For those interested in making wood fenders; I made a set about a month ago,
http://www.sonic.net/~maryking/wooden_fenders.html
Drew
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Touring mailing list
Browse and search the archives: http://search.bikelist.org
http://www.phred.org/mailman/options/touring

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[Michel Gagnon]

Post by Tim Smith
I've been doing some re-thinking about using these on a touring bike.
It started when I was about to install that classy leather front mud
flap that you can get as an accessory for Berthoud stainless steel
fenders. Then I thought "Hey, wait a minute! This is a touring bike,
not a commuting bike. A flap will keep your feet drier on a short ride
in the rain, but if you ride in the rain for an hour or more, you're
going to get wet anyhow". So I decided to hold off installing it for now.

I like to "keep it simple". So fenders and mudflaps are there year
round. Judging by other loaded tourers I see, the fenders and mudflaps
keep me cleaner. Besides, they also protect my gear, my leather saddle,
my drivetrain. And I sure was happy to have them when I rode som 10 km
in fresh tar...

[MH]

I need to fit some on my trailer because
tar and other road debris is a mess.

While seeing the sites on my sit down bike
this young lady in white pants and shirt
had come down the wet trail on her
stand up bike without fenders or panniers
heading through town with a streak up her
backside and in her blonde hair.

[d***@public.gmane.org]

I don't know if anyone mentioned this or not, but one of the main benefits I see with fenders is to keep rocks from chipping the paint. I'm fond of buying cheap used bikes as beater and commuter bikes, and by far the worst rust they have is always on the underside of the downtube. Yes, you can also combat this problem by covering the downtube with clear packaging tape, but a fender will do the job better and will also help keep crud off the drivetrain.

Someone also mentioned "Amish exhaust." The same problem occurs anyplace there are large birds -- seagulls, geese, ducks, etc. Here in Madison, where some bike paths are close to the lakes, bird droppings can be dense in spots and very gross. Maybe not an issue for touring, but potentially a major issue for commuting.

For all of these reasons, I'm sold on fenders, except perhaps on go-fast, fair-weather bikes.

doug
madison, wi

[Jim Foreman]

----- Original Message -----
From: <dpfrang-***@public.gmane.org>
To: <touring-***@public.gmane.org>
Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 7:41 PM
Subject: Re: Fenders/Mudguards on a Touring Bike?

Post by d***@public.gmane.org
Someone also mentioned "Amish exhaust." The same problem occurs anyplace

there are large birds -- seagulls, geese, ducks, etc. Here in Madison,
where some bike paths are close to the lakes, bird droppings can be dense in
spots and very gross. Maybe not an issue for touring, but potentially a
major issue for commuting.
The worst "organic" problem I ever came across was on Mackinac
Island....

Jim

[James Arlen]

Goose droppings on the Waterfront Trail in Ontario... in some places,
they're so thick that the pavement of the trail is an awful shade of
green.

The trouble is that it's slippery and sticky... so you have to ride
slow... your bike reeks until you can get the inside of the fenders
washed out.

It's terrifying. I'd take either horse or dog any day.

JamieA

Post by John Meier
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 7:41 PM
Subject: Re: Fenders/Mudguards on a Touring Bike?

Post by d***@public.gmane.org
Someone also mentioned "Amish exhaust." The same problem occurs anypla

ce

Post by John Meier
there are large birds -- seagulls, geese, ducks, etc. Here in Madison,
where some bike paths are close to the lakes, bird droppings can be dense in
spots and very gross. Maybe not an issue for touring, but potentially a
major issue for commuting.
The worst "organic" problem I ever came across was on Mackinac
Island....
Jim
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Touring mailing list
Browse and search the archives: http://search.bikelist.org
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